My two 5 Cent Ben Franklins 1847

Discussion in 'What's it Worth?' started by notional, Mar 2, 2019.

  1. notional

    notional New Member

    Hi all, just wondering here not just value, but more importantly, what coloring etc. the experts believe. As I can't really define what colors of these two I have. Thank you for all information that can be provided!
     

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    notional, Mar 2, 2019
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  2. Hochstrasse

    Hochstrasse Moderator Moderator

    Hi Notional,
    Just from looking at your scans I would say the Franklin stamp on the left with 4 borders is a dark brown variety and the one on the right with 3 1/2 borders is a red brown. This is simply my opinion, but I personally own a dark brown and a red brown on cover and your stamps mirror mine.
     
    Hochstrasse, Mar 2, 2019
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  3. notional

    notional New Member

    Thanks! Makes sense, but when I try to judge them on my own, I was getting a little conflicted.
     
    notional, Mar 2, 2019
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  4. Molokai

    Molokai Moderator Moderator

    Hi <HOCH> Are your covers in Alexander's Cover Census book?
     
    Molokai, Mar 3, 2019
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  5. JCG

    JCG Member

    Notional, there is a standard set of books for determining United States stamp colors. It is called White's Encyclopedia of the Colors of Us Postage Stamps, it is very difficult to find and when you do find one, and the cost for the multi-volume set that was recently bought at auction went for $610 US dollars.
     
    JCG, Mar 3, 2019
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  6. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    Notional,
    I do not own a USA 1 or 2.
    I just had a look at my "good old" Michel USA Spezial 1980.
    The range of listed colours of the 5 Cents is extensive:

    USA.jpg
    As Hochstraße hinted,it is not easy to be certain,let alone by a scan.
    If you really want to be sure,you will have to give your stamps for an
    expertise.
    By the way the left stamp shows a nice plate flaw: "dot in the S of U S".
    Listed by Michel as 1 II.
     
    Werner Salentin, Mar 3, 2019
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  7. Molokai

    Molokai Moderator Moderator

    Molokai, Mar 3, 2019
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  8. notional

    notional New Member

    Wow...thanks for all the input! Especially noticing the dot in the 'S'. Something I had never heard nor read about. I'll have to investigate further!
     
    notional, Mar 3, 2019
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  9. notional

    notional New Member

    How would the plate flaw affect value? By how much too?
     
    notional, Mar 3, 2019
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  10. Hochstrasse

    Hochstrasse Moderator Moderator

    Hi Molokai,
    I don't know because I have no idea about the book. It is a very nice cover though sent to William Briscoe Stone of Haberdeventure in Port Tobacco, Maryland. The home is administered by the National Park Service. While a famous lawyer in his own right he is a nephew of Thomas Stone, one of the signers of the Declaration of Independence. The Stone family has a storied political history as a colonial governor and other elected offices, William is the son of Congressman Michael J. Stone.
     
    Hochstrasse, Mar 3, 2019
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  11. Molokai

    Molokai Moderator Moderator

    There are three to W.B. Stone showing in the online census, one without an image; perhaps yours!:)

    https://www.uspcs.org/resource-center/censuses/1847-cover-census/
     
    Molokai, Mar 3, 2019
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  12. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    As you can imagine prices may have changed since 1980.But not as much as one might guess.
    5 C. in dark brown with a red cancellation is listed with DM 1600.-
    same with a black cancellation DM 1700.-
    dot in S (red cancellation) DM 1800.-
    If you take todays exchange rates as 1.- $ US = DM 2.-,you will have
    roughly 2019 catalogue values.
    Here the illustration of the flaw from taken from Michel:
    USA 1 II.jpg
     
    Werner Salentin, Mar 3, 2019
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  13. Hochstrasse

    Hochstrasse Moderator Moderator

    Hi Molokai,
    If my cover is on the list it would have to be the one without the picture. I'll check the date if it is readable and let you know. That a very nice and useful link. Grazie Molokai.
     
    Hochstrasse, Mar 3, 2019
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  14. Hochstrasse

    Hochstrasse Moderator Moderator

    Hi Molokai,
    The letter is dated April 25, 1849 and the cancel is April 27th so it is none of the 3 listed W. B. Stone covers in the census. Like the census covers it also was sent from Washington D.C.. The first cover on the census is a lot like mine and the handwriting appears to come from the same hand. The cancel is on the stamp rather than pen cancelled. I wish I had a scanner so I could post it, my digital camera makes a lot of glare appear on surfaces I photograph so I sort of gave up trying to take pictures of my stamps and covers. If I have a chance to get a good photo I will try to post it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2019
    Hochstrasse, Mar 3, 2019
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