Classical Stamps

Discussion in 'What's it Worth?' started by Werner Salentin, Oct 1, 2016.

  1. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    Robert,
    you may be right !
    But in any case I take every bet,that the forged 1 pound-coins are worth much more than 2 pounds.
    Maybe,that was the idea of the not that stupid Irish Man ?

    Werner
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2020
  2. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Italien 2.jpg
    Italy
    upper stamp: 1/2 Grano,issued 1861 for the former kingdom of Naples.
    (from a set of 8)
    middle: 80 C.,issued Oct,3rd,1862. (from a set of 4) In used condition a very
    expensive stamp.
    bottom: additional value,issued Jan.1st,1863.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  3. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Italien 16.jpg
    issued Dec.1st,1863;
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  4. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Italien 23.jpg
    1 C. issued 1863, 2 C. issued March 1st,1865, 20 C. issued April 1867;
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  5. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    [​IMG]
    The above letter with a 9 Kreuzer Baden missprint on green paper (the paper of the 6 Kreuzer),instead on lilac rose paper,was sold in Germany for roughly
    US-$ 1.8 millions,fees and taxes incl.
    It is said to be the highest price payed for a german stamp ever.
    Three specimens of this missprint are known.Two on letter,one on a letter-piece.
    The sold letter belonged to the collection of the german billionaire Erivan Haub,who died 2018,aged 85.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
    DonSellos likes this.
  6. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Modena 1.jpg
    The Duchy of Modena issued six stamps 5,10,15,25,40 C. and 1 Lira on June 1st,1851.Except of the 15 and 25 C. (no period only) all values exist with or
    without a period after the figures of value.

    In 1859 a provisional government issued five more stamps,prior the introduction of the stamps of Sardinia and later of Italy.
    There are also five newspaper tax stamps,issued 1853/59.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  7. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Parma 2.jpg
    Parma,first series,issued June 1st,1852.
    Except of the 10 C. all stamps (5,15,25,40 C.) of the first series
    were printed on coloured paper.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  8. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Parma 6.jpg
    Parma,second series coloured on white paper,
    issued Dec.31st,1853 (5 C.),Dec.30th,1853 (15 C.) and 25 C., I do not have),
    issued May 28th,1855.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  9. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Parma 10.jpg
    One stamp only of the third series.
    issued: 15 C. March 4th,1859,25 C. July 3rd,1857,40 C. June 30th,1857

    After the abolition of the duchy 1859,stamps of Sardinia were used for a short time.End of August/September a set of five stamps and two newspaper-tax
    stamps were issued by the provisional government.
    In March 1860 Parma became a part of Sardinia and subsequently of Italy.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  10. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    V Romagna 5.jpg
    Romagna was part of the Papal State.It broke away in 1859 and joined the
    united Italy soon after.
    Nine stamps were issued in 1859 (1/2,1,2,3,4,5,6,8,20 Bajocchi).
    Except of the shown 4 B.,the stamps were not used a lot.So mint stamps
    are much cheaper than used ones and cancel-forgeries are plentiful.
     
  11. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    The kindom of Sardinia was,apart from the island,situated in the north-west
    of Italy.In 1859/60 Sardinia annexed nearly all other Italian States and
    was renamed Kingdom of Italy.
    V Sardinien 2.jpg
    upper right: first issue 1851 3 val. 5,20 (shown),40 C.

    The second issue of 1853 is like 1851,but now the head of the king
    and insriptions are embossed.

    lower left: third issue 1854 same values,frame fully coloured,head of the king colourless embossed.Shown is the 20 C.

    upper left and lower right: fourth issue 1855-63,head only embossed.
    This series is rich in different prints,shades etc.
    5,10,20,40 (shown),80 C.,3 L. (shown).The bronze colour of the 3 L.
    appears brown on my scan.
    Same stamps perforated = Italy 1862 issue.

    Two newspaper stamps (1 and 2 C.) were issued in 1861,what show the
    numerals embossed in the centre oval.
     
  12. sforgca

    sforgca New Member

    No Known forgeries?
    Fournier made abundant forgeries of all the T&T and different fake cancels
    Placido Ramon De Torres made several forgeries also in large quantities but somewhat crude
    There are also several types of crude forgeries from an unknown source
    In 1909 large numbers of reprints were made from original plates but as they were not government approved to be resold the word "reprint" means little else than forgeries in this case
    Then there are the imperfs that were fake and perfed by the Senf brothers
    Also numerous fake imperfs from trimmed later rouletted issues - easy to tell by the embossing
    And of course many fake cancels. This would be next to impossible to determine without genuine cancel samples
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  13. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    I am by no means an expert for Thurn and Taxis and do not have
    a lot of literature about forgeries.
    According to Opitz "Wissen schützt vor Schaden",Fournier "only
    played a secondary part",but faked a lot of cancels.
    The 1909 reprints were produced on the order of the Thurn and Taxis
    Central-Archive in Regensburg.7500 stamps each (33) were reprinted.
    Michel lists them for Euro 5.- each.
    There are a few other forgeries,- Sperati did the 1/3 Sgr. -,but they
    are rare and more valuable than the originals.
    Apart from alterations,that I had described before and faked cancels,
    Thurn and Taxis is very "secure" to collect,if you only use your
    "healthy mind".
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  14. sforgca

    sforgca New Member

    These comment seems to differ from your earlier post that there are no T&T forgeries.
    The thing about forgeries is very simple - if one article/book says there are X number of forgeries - you are guaranteed there are X+ forgeries
    As for the plentiful fake cancels without samples of the genuine cancels, a "healthy mind" would not be of any use.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  15. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    sforgca,
    you probably misunderstood me: with a "healthy mind",or
    if you like common sense,I mean you should keep simple
    precautions,when buying Thurn und Taxis stamps.
    An example (the most extreme one):
    Michel 45 (1/4 Gr. coloured rouletting,1866) costs
    mint € 3.-,used € 1300.-.If you have interest in a used one
    and are no expert yourself,you miss a healthy mind,
    if you buy it without the expertise of an internationally
    regognized expert.It´s probably even better,to stay away
    from such used rarities at all.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  16. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    The Electorate of Hannover (the name changed several times
    over the centuries) became a kingdom in 1814.
    The Prince Elector of Hannover became king of England as
    George I in 1714.
    The personal union of Hannover and Britain remained till the death
    of William IV.Victoria became queen of Britain,but could not become
    queen of Hannover,because in Hannover male-succession was the
    rule.
    Hannover issued stamps from 1850 till 1865.25 main-numbers,
    according to Michel.
    Hannover 1,2.jpg
    upper: Mi.no.1,issued Dec.1st,1850
    lower: Mi.no.2,issued July 30th,1851
    Except for the different colours of the paper,the stamps also have
    different watermarks.
    Both stamps were valid within the kingdom only.
    The Hannover currency (till 1858) was:
    1 Thaler = 24 Gutengroschen = 288 (gute) Pfennige
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  17. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    Hannover 3,5.jpg
    Stamps for use to countries of the "Deutsch-Österreichischer-Postverein"
    (German-Austrian-Postcommunity) in (prussian) Thaler/Silbergroschen currency.
    Issued mid-July 1851.The shown colour-variety of the 1/30th Thaler
    was issued in Feb.1855.
    Since 1854 the stamps became valid for postage to all foreign countries.
    They were also valid for inland-mail,but use is extremely rare,because
    the different currency parities made it impossible to frank letters
    correctly.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  18. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    w Hannover 13b.jpg
    The face value of the above stamp may look strange,if you have some
    knowledge about the Thaler/Silbergroschen currency.
    One Silbergroschen was made up by 12 Pfennige.So a 1/3 (EIN DRITTEL) Silbergroschen would be 4 Pfennige.
    But there were two currencies in Hannover.
    The 3 Pfennige stands for Gute Pfennige.However it was even more
    complicated,as 3 Gute Pfennige were equivalent to 3.75 Pfennige in
    Silbergroschen currency only.But that discrepancy was simply ignored
    or accepted.
    The shown stamp is not the one,what was issued on April 15th,1853
    (Michel no.6),but the later one issued in February 1859 (Michel no.13)
    The design is identical,but the 1859 version was printed on paper
    without watermark,while that of 1853 has the watermark "oak-garland".
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  19. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    w Hannover 7.jpg
    altered background,instead of a solid yellow background of the 1851
    issue,the above stamp,issued in Dec.1855 has a mesh-network background.This one is the only,where the meshes are narrow.
     
    DonSellos likes this.
  20. Werner Salentin

    Werner Salentin Well-Known Member

    w Hannover 9.jpg
    1856/57 stamps of the previous designs were issued again,
    now with a mesh-network background of wide meshes.
    Missing from the set is the 3 Pfennige in the same design as shown
    in post #438,but now with a dark-grey mesh-network background.
     
Draft saved Draft deleted
Similar Threads: Classical Stamps
Forum Title Date
What's it Worth? stamps Aug 31, 2020
What's it Worth? Who knows the worth of these stamps? Aug 31, 2020
What's it Worth? Mexican Stamps from 1930's Apr 22, 2020
What's it Worth? Lots of stamps Feb 24, 2020
What's it Worth? Can you help me identify these Peoples Republic of China stamps Feb 17, 2020

Share This Page